Hay, dammit!

[altivo]

This is getting really frustrating, not to mention risky.

It's bad enough that our regular supplier quit making hay without telling us or responding to a half dozen phone calls about it back in June. But now we can't find anyone to sell us hay at any price. One nearby place offered it at double the price we'd been paying, plus delivery charge, and we agreed to try a hundred bales. He was supposed to bring them today, didn't show up.

Called him, he "forgot." Now it's raining, so no delivery today. We have enough left for about a week at most.

Calls to two or three other places that have advertisements just get answering machines and no return calls. One of them says in their message that they "return all calls within 24 hours." No, they don't. We've been trying them for two weeks now.

Anyone want some sheep? I have eight smallish ones, decent wool producers. Mixed breed, Southdown-Finn-Merino mostly. If you can house and feed them, I'll give them to you. If things get bad enough, I'll have to send them to slaughter and we'd much rather avoid that if possible.

My three horses are a different story. Somehow I have to keep them. We'd consider selling the two geldings to a good home, but in the present economy that's not likely to happen. Tess is mine and I'm keeping her.

I'd actually consider buying a semi load of hay from farther away, except that I know the truck couldn't get in and out of our drive. I don't know what to try next.

Comments

[songdogmi.livejournal.com]

That's a fix you're in, to be sure. I don't have any solutions. The only thing I thought of was, would it be worthwhile to get a large bale and rent a Bobcat or something like it for a weekend to help break it down into smaller chunks? Even as I type that, it sounds iffy at best, though. Might be cheaper than owning a Bobcat but still not cheap.

I suppose in a few weeks, we'll hear on the radio about the hay shortage and high prices. Business news hasn't quite picked up on it yet.

Here's hoping things work out much sooner than later.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

It's been a bad year for hay here, yes. Too much rain, not enough sun, and higher prices for fertilizer and fuel are contributors to increasing prices. I knew I'd have to pay more, and I am resigned to that. What aggravates me is people not returning calls even if all they have to say is "Sorry, we don't have any." Heck, if they don't have any to sell, why not change their message to say so. And why not cancel the ads?

[deffox]

Is it possible to consider alternate foods? Something like silage for a while?

Up here there are bales along the highway from the mowed medians. It's probably a mix of wild grasses and random farm plants that spread out of the fields.

[zenicurean.livejournal.com]

That's so absolutely shoddy of them. What a completely rubbish business ethic. They "forgot?" What on earth is that about? One does not "forget" business transactions!

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Can't feed sileage to horses. They founder on it.

The sheep could maybe eat it, but I'm not set up to produce it here, and no one ships that around. It's sloppy.

Wild grass and weeds makes good horse hay, actually. Alfalfa isn't desirable, where the cow and sheep folks prefer to have the alfalfa included. The problem with hay from highway right of ways is often the amount of pollution and trash that gets included in it.

We'll find an answer, it's just aggravating that people aren't more forthright.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

You'd think that, but in the US it has become more and more a standard mode of operation. Deliveries? Oops, didn't get as far as your address. Plumbers or electricians? Oops, another job took too long, didn't get there. Can we come next Tuesday? Since everyone acts the same way, it doesn't matter any more.

[zenicurean.livejournal.com]

It's a poor, poor way to be in. My father sold hay for quite a long time. He would probably prefer to have these people flogged or something.

[murakozi.livejournal.com]

That downright stinks. Are all the hay suppliers independent out there? The riding stable here's supplier is actually a sort of consolidator or reseller. They get hay from a number of suppliers and distribute it. Of course, they tend to cater to large consumption customers.

We get hay delivered in semi trailers (usually ones that used to belong to moving companies) that they drop onsite until we call to have another delivered. You can usually tell when hay from more than one source is on a trailer as the bale size, hay quality/color, and even the twine used will change slightly.

I do hope you can find a source to keep you going through the winter.

[schnee.livejournal.com]

Meh, that sounds like a problem indeed - I have no idea what to suggest, but I hope you can get it worked out in the end.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yeah, they sure aren't flogging their hay very hard. Unfortunately, I need what they have, so I can't afford to be too rough on them.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Everything here is that independent. Trying to get well service or roofing or anything of that sort is just as difficult. That's why we were so glad to have a reliable supplier until now. I had no idea he was holding his price so far below the market for us, though.

If I could get a semi delivery, I'd take it. We'd unload into our own storage and they could pick the trailer back up. The trouble is, our drive is steep and narrow, and lined with trees. The only possible turnaround would be to pull into one end of the arena and out the other, and it's tight. A good driver could do it, I'm pretty sure, but the last time someone tried that with a smaller truck (years ago) he got stuck in the mud coming out the north door...

We'll find a solution, I'm sure, and if it means getting rid of the sheep, I can live with that. The horses are what matters to me.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

We will, I'm sure, thanks. It's just stressful and irritating.

[schnee.livejournal.com]

Oh, yes, I can imagine - definitely the kind of thing one doesn't want to (have to) deal with.

*hugs*

[rrwolf.livejournal.com]

Farmer Bob has hay, ask quickcasey

[altivo.livejournal.com]

*snicker*

Farmer Bob has exploding balers too. When we discussed it, Casey said their hay was already sold. The distance is an issue too, since I don't have my own haywagon or truck.

[quoting-mungo.livejournal.com]

Huh. We've "always" fed silage (or haylage) to our horses, as did my horse's previous owners, and the only horse that ever had a problem was an Icelandic Pony that was stabled here for a while which couldn't handle the high protein content in that particular batch and thus had stomach upsets. All I ever heard of its suitability (excepting case-by-case consideration; some horses can't eat hardly anything, while my horse does nothing worse than put on weight if he eats stupid shit) was to make sure the horses are up to date on their botulism shots.

May be regional differences in content and preparation, though.

I wish I was more surprised at farmers forgetting about the smaller-scale customers, though. We've had to scramble for winter food or bedding a few times because our neighbors (using the term loosely here) forgot that they'd promised us this or that and didn't have any left when we reminded them.


-Alexandra

[aureth.livejournal.com]

Email me your phone number and address, and I'll see about getting some hay your way. I happened to ask one hay producer today how he was sitting for supply, and his supply was pretty much spoken for, but I know three more in the Richmond/McHenry area.

Could a pickup truck and a gooseneck trailer get turned around in your lot?

If it comes to it, I can see how my parents over in Antioch are sitting for a supply. It's been quite a few years since they've done any delivery, though. I'd probably end up doing it with one of the weekend kids they hire.

jim at jdoolittle.net

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Thanks. I think we have it solved now. We found a feed store just over the line in Wisconsin that consolidates for small producers. They just brought in 3000 bales and expect that many more next week. A better price ($4 for grass hay) and they'll deliver loads at no extra cost.

The supplier who brought the bales today can also provide more at that price ($4, and no delivery charge.) That one is in Woodstock.

Yes, our former supplier used to come in with a pickup truck and a regular hay rack on a sleeve hitch to his bumper. He could drop the rack in the arena next to our storage area, turn his truck and go right back out the same door. In fact, he did it once with two racks hitched together, but we decided against repeating that because it was so hard getting them back out afterward. Usually we just roll the empty back out by hand. Two of us can push and steer it, and we park it where it can be picked up after the next one is dropped. The Wisconsin folks said they could work the same way (Main Street Feeds in Walworth.) They'd like to bring us loads immediately from the field, so as not to have to unload and reload, and we prefer that too, so it should work. They expect to be getting grass hay starting Monday unless the weather sours.

I really do appreciate your offer of help. For the moment, though, I think it's under control. I was just getting really fed up with people who won't return their calls. All they have to say is "Sorry, we're all out," or whatever, but it seems to be too much bother.

If you hear of anyone who wants sheep, though, that offer still stands. We've had our fun, and need to simplify here.

[quickcasey.livejournal.com]

Because Bob was rescued buy the guy with the new baler, (see my post) they had to share the hay profits, because of the borrowed equipment, so I had no say.
Also we have no good way to transport a significant amount.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

We've got it solved I think. Thanks to the aquarium guy who comes into the library twice a month. He asked how I was today and I said "grumpy." After the ensuing conversation, he called his wife, who called a friend, who called someone else who called him back with the name and number of a promising source. Gary talked to them and put us on their delivery schedule for next week. Meanwhile he found someone in Woodstock who sent over 60 bales on short notice this afternoon, and at a lower price than the no-show guy was asking even though he's just a mile up the road from us.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Thought I'd answered this, but apparently it didn't go through. Probably got distracted at work and never clicked "post."

Anyway, silage here is generally made from corn (maize) by chopping up the whole cobs and often the plant entire. It's loaded with carbohydrates, both starches and simple sugars. In fact, it usually ferments to alcohol and then the alcohol goes on to vinegar before you feed it. Ruminants like cows and sheep can handle it just fine, but the high carbs tend to founder horses pretty quickly unless they are introduced to it very gradually over a long period of time. I've seen the feet on some ponies who were allowed to eat silage along with the cows, and they were totally ruined. Handling wet silage requires bunkers or a silo and I have neither here in any case.

Haylage, being made mostly from grass, can be fed to horses as long as it has been kept free of mold. The mold can be really bad, though, and I have one guy who gets the heaves from mold spores already. This year's weather was weird enough that we didn't have a problem, and that was good.

I understand that haylage is widely used for horses there in Sweden, but it's pretty unusual here. Dry hay is more typical here, and I've never actually seen anyone producing true haylage in sealed bales or bunkers. Because of the extra wrapping and the careful moisture control needed, I'd expect prepared haylage in sealed bales to be quite a bit more expensive than ordinary hay, if it were available at all.

[captpackrat.livejournal.com]

We might be able to take one or two ewes. We already have two Babydoll Southdowns and two Pygmy goats.

[quoting-mungo.livejournal.com]

That's odd; the way Wikipedia presents it the distinction between silage/haylage appeared to be that silage is wetter, essentially. If it's made from stuff other than what hay's made of over there, no wonder it's no good for horses. We're going to have to look around for someone who makes the wetter stuff when we run out of our current supply, as Albert's asthma can't handle what we currently have very well and soaking hay gets messy real quickly.

Honestly haylage tends to be cheaper here, because it's so much less sensitive than good hay (unless you have idiots on the farm who don't get the concept of "do not break the plastic wrap on the haylage on pain of death" - long as the wrap is intact it's fine). Which is just as well, because we do occassionally have to throw out like half of one of those great big bales. Small haylage bales do get more expensive, mostly because at that point you have proportionally more wrapping.

That's a major reason we feed it, as well; we can't seem to get good hay to stay good throughout a whole winter, our loft is too damp. Straw is usually fine, but hay tends to get iffy and possibly moldy pretty quick.

[heavens-steed.livejournal.com]

I am truly sorry to hear about your plight and I worry for your animals, especially the sheep if they potentially face slaughter.

I wish I could take you up on the geldings offer but alas, that's impossible. :( Times are unkind to everyone, it seems. I hope you are able to figure something out.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Our flock is almost all wethers now. You could have the two ewes remaining but I have no idea how I'd get them to you over such a distance.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Thanks, but don't worry too much about it. We seem to have found a source now.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Everything in America is corn. It's really true.

Climate differences probably account for the difference in farming practices. This has been an exceptionally wet season for us. Normally, hay making and storage is not difficult here. In ten years, we've had a mold problem just once, and I think a slight change in our storage practices has reduced the chance of it happening again.

The stringent requirement to maintain haylage in airtight containment seems to be a worse complication to me. I also imagine things like putrifaction and botulism could be issues unless the moisture level of the preparation is perfect. Corn silage is pickled in its own vinegar, which prevents the growth of most anaerobic infections such as botulism. It's rather like making sauerkraut, only from corn. Cows love the stuff but I get really tired of the vinegar smell in a hurry.

[captpackrat.livejournal.com]

Just how small are they? What we have now are pure Babydoll Southdowns; they stand just 2 feet high at the withers. We can't really handle anything much bigger.

We also don't have a dedicated sheep trailer, but we do have a pickup with a shell. We've transported Southdowns and Pygmy goats in it easily, and even once used it to move a full-grown Suffolk ram a short distance.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I've never measured one. The ram was supposedly pure babydoll. He had papers anyway. But I think he was taller than that. Less than 30 inches but 24 sounds awfully small. I think all of ours are probably bigger than that.