Altivo's Fabulous Furry Tales #1: Sewell, Saunders, Salten

[altivo]

Success...I think.

<==Download podcast here.

A ten minute discussion of the beginnings of furry literature in English, featuring the work of Anna Sewell, Marshall Saunders, and Felix Salten. Listeners invited to comment here or via e-mail (address contained in podcast).

<==For those brave enough to want to subscribe.

Written transcript also available upon request. I was worried about background noises and such during recording, but had more trouble figuring out the technology of Audacity and the USB headset. I believe the quality of the result is more than adequate, though. Hope you enjoy it. :)

Comments

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Certainly it'd be impossible to cover them all ... but just out of curiosity, have you read any Rutherford Montgomery or William Horwood?

I noticed Jack London didn't make your cut, either ... too common? heh.

London (Call of the Wild) and Montgomery (Yellow Eyes) are both names that come to mind for me, specifically, when thinking of writers of furry fiction who endeavoured to un-demonize natural predators. Sadly, they fell very much on predominantly deaf ears within the U.S. powers that be, as evidenced by the complete extermination of the wolf from the vast majority of the U.S. (aside from Alaska) through the 1950s.

I also remember reading "Pleasant Journeys" by Pleasant DeSpain when I was a child, featuring some stories I remember being furry ... another book you might want to peruse on the topic.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Oh, and I love your voice. :) Soft and smooth.

[calydor.livejournal.com]

But he sings like a woman!

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Heh. You haven't heard me sing... yet. I picked Connable for the obvious reason, though I avoided getting into raptures about how literature gives wings to the mind and all that. Besides, she's in Creative Commons so I could use her without violating any copyrights.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

*blushes and scuffs the ground with a hoof*

Aw, thanks. Time spent as an actor and a singer undoubtedly helps, but I'm sure many think I sound too "fruity". ;P

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

You have a golden orator voice compared with, say, me. I took and failed 'Public Speaking' 4 times in college not trying to get the credit, but just so I can learn to be conversational. I finally gave up, it was too expensive and dragging down my GPA. :/

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure public speaking classes are worth much as a rule, though the Toastmasters Club does seem to help a lot of folks in that respect.

For the most part, Donald Duck aside, our voices are the product of genes and we can't do a lot about it one way or another. I have my father's voice I think. To my ear, I sound very much like him. My brothers had tenor voices, but I inherited his baritone.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Its not so much the sound of my voice as it is my uhhs, umms, stutters and how I seem to lose all cohesive thought in verbal conversation. Somebody asks me something and I know an important answer, but it all flutters away when I am talking to them until afterward when I suddenly remember something important, significant and relevant I should have mentioned that completely slipped my mind. I'm always caught off-guard when asked a question. :/

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Toastmasters then. Gary belongs to it and the experience vastly improved his ability to speak before a group or to answer the complicated ad hoc question. I don't think membership is expensive, either. They have a regular program of activities with structured brief presentations (like, say, a five minute talk giving instruction on performing some task.) By all accounts it's quite a friendly environment and the programs are very well-designed. Sort of a "boy scouts" that focuses on speaking as its goal.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Jack London is slated for a future 'cast, and William Horwood comes after a discussion of Grahame himself. :)

I had forgotten about Montgomery, thanks for the reminder to put him on the list. Plenty of material. If I have listeners, I'll keep at it.

Only so much fits in ten minutes. I want to keep the download size to 5 MB or so for other dialup users like myself. (Not to mention the fact that 3-4 hours of research and writing went into that 10 minute segment. Whew.)

Anyway, glad you liked it.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

And of course you'd have to spank yourself if you forgot P.S.B. :)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Peter S. Beagle? I'm sure we'll get to him, though I confess that his work that made the strongest impression on me wasn't The Last Unicorn but rather the autobiographical I See by my Outfit.

[calydor.livejournal.com]

Certainly an interesting listen; your voice isn't quite as I expected, but very close.

You seem to get through each book thoroughly, but if I may offer some amount of constructive criticism, your past as a teacher shines through. A lot.

You sound detached, as if it's a memorized you're reciting for someone else to type down as you speak. I miss a sense of enthusiasm, of urge to share.

Also, and this is more a technical suggestion, I know from listening to 2's outtakes on his rants that it can be a good idea to cut things up at each natural stop, so if you don't get through a line properly, you can redo that instead of the whole cast. You may have done that, I don't know, but to my ears it sounded like you were choking on a couple of lines in there. May also be a difference in accents, of course.

But all in all, a pleasant listen, and I'm looking forward to the next one. I'll save my suggestions for books until we reach 'current' authors, though.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Hee. Well, no, I don't particularly want to sound like 2. Not at all. I knew that this particular take would sound a bit too scholarly, but I felt it was important background material.

It was recorded in one run. Well, three takes, actually, but the last was used entire. After I figure out the features of Audacity better, I'll probably be able to do more cutting and pasting. I thought I was doing well to get the song excerpt inserted and the ID3 tags right.

First take was spoiled by the doorbell and dogs going off like atom bombs. Two young guys with a pickup full of hay. Nope, we didn't order any, in fact we just took delivery on 155 bales yesterday. But I'll bet you want the lady next door (the Brit with her rescue horse.)

Second take was OK but muffled sounding. I almost went with it until it dawned on me that Audacity was using the mic built into my monitor instead of the one on the headset. Duh. Worked that out and it was quite an improvement. Even I am reasonably satisfied with the way I sound. :)

[calydor.livejournal.com]

I didn't mean for you to sound like 2, just that I had some experience from reading how he edits his rants, that's all. It was a technical idea, remember? :-)

[corelog.livejournal.com]

*instant save-targ-as*

[corelog.livejournal.com]

---thoughts transpire---

Oh gods...you sound SO MUCH like a pro radio personality. :) A bit on the dry side, perhaps, but not so bad. A very intellectual recitation and discussion.

Intro music was good, btw. :)

Yay for Canadian authors! :D

*chuckle* Trust a librarian to be able to make an appropriate copyright and use statement at the end of his podcast...

---end thoughts---


A nice beginning. :) I have to admit to not being entirely fond of the hard, graphic tales mentioned. I've never read (or even heard of) Beautiful Joe, but it sounds much like the one I know best--Black Beauty.

Bambi I've only ever known through Disney, and that was bad enough. I had nightmares for weeks about fire after that, something that was to plague me on and off for many, many more long years in my childhood. The fear and terror really imprinted on my mind, and I still bear the mark, tempered now though it be with determination fueled by rage and cold, merciless calculation.

Even as a child's story, my heart was broken by Black Beauty, and even the "happy ending" was bittersweet, because of all that had come before. That happiness, to me, couldn't erase or even lessen the horrors and pain of the past.

Now I've grown up some. I'm better able to handle and control my emotions. But I still don't want to really read about such things unless I absolutely must. Especially if those were the "light" versions. Beauty I can at least sympathize with, as I now have a better understanding of how the ending could be truly a happy ending, lessening the pain which came before. But I still don't feel the need to subject myself to such great turmoil again.

I haven't watched Bambi more than three or four times in my whole life. Last time I watched, I decided that it had lost the impact it used to have, but I am also now at the point where because I am protecting myself from any potential weakness it might exploit, it has no meaning at all to me. The book would be different, but do I really need to be hit with more of that impact? I don't believe so. I haven't watched Black Beauty in years. Even knowing the ending, why should I push myself through the pain and sadness it brings? Interesting to note, though, that my favorite character in Black Beauty always was Ginger. She fought back against the oppression.

Okay, I'm going to go listen to something to brighten my mood now. :) Reflection on the darker parts of my former years leaves me in need of that. Ta-ra for now, then!

Oh...and as a tiny little suggestion, you may consider sounding actually interested in your material, rather than discussing it like a dry English prof who regards it as merely an object to be debated dispassionately, hmm? ;)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Well, yeah. Think classical radio station announcer, those guys are my.. idols? Glad I came close.

See above for remarks about the scholarly approach. Partly the rather elderly nature of the material, and partly my own need to distance myself from the highly emotional subjects.

My Mom read Black Beauty to my brother and me as a bedtime book. It was the original uncut, and she left nothing out. I guess she thought better of it when I started sobbing over Ginger's death, but she did finish the whole thing over a period of two or three weeks.

I had the same reaction to the Disney film version of Bambi that you did. In fact, my father carried me weeping from the theater in the middle of it. Never got as far as the fire. I only read the original much later in life, when I was in college. It wasn't the fire (which I didn't see that first time) but the murder of Bambi's mother by the hunters that I couldn't handle.

Beautiful Joe I never encountered until after meeting my mate, Gary. He had a permanent attachment to the book, and I read it at his urging. It is very well done, but I agree you might better avoid it if you have difficulty with the graphic violence. (I'm surprised to hear this from someone who plays video games much, though.)

I find the Mark Twain stories to be the most powerful of those I mentioned. I didn't read from them because I can't do it without getting choked up. And that's why this edition seems a bit dry. I had to be cool and scholarly or I couldn't read even those excerpts clearly. No one wants to listen to me breaking down and sobbing. ;P

Better things and much enthusiasm to come, I promise. Jack London, Kenneth Grahame, C. J. Cherryh, Mercedes Lackey, Anne McCaffrey, David Brin, John Varley, and more writers that I can talk about without breaking into tears.

Thanks for listening, wuffy. Seeya tonight, I trust.

[corelog.livejournal.com]

It's not so much the graphic violence I have problems with, as it is the emotions that ensue. I can handle graphic violence without problems if the violence is being done to an unrepentant enemy...or if I suppress my own emotions. But where there is emotional content in a story, I must either discard it with much affronted and arrogant noise, or I must accept it and let the emotions swirl through my very core. It's just the way I am.

And FYI, I don't play much video games. :) If I do play a game, it's generally a mission-oriented game (which helps me focus) and abstracted (I'm either destroying enemy ships, or I'm shooting enemies who will kill me if I don't kill them first, or I'm merely giving orders in a stretegic setting). I don't do freeform violence like the GTA series. That's just so not me.

Anne McCaffery...Dragonriders of Pern, yes? Love her. :D Also loved the book which handled dolphins... "Naw fish! Doll-fin!" *giggles*

[altivo.livejournal.com]

All the violence of videogaming repulses me. It seems utterly pointless. :)

Yes, the Dragonriders and Dolphins of Pern will be topics. Also Mercedes Lackey's Valdemar, where some humans are chosen by special telepathic horses to be their life partners in a manner similar to that of McCaffrey's Dragonriders.

Some less familiar but richly furry novels, like Stephen R. Boyett's The Architect of Sleep or C. J. Cherryh's Chanur series are definitely on my promotion list. Narnia, of course. And more importantly for me, Lewis' Out of the Silent Planet. Brian Jacques' Redwall series, and an old favorite of mine now forgotten by everyone, Flyball the space cat, will appear. I'd like to touch on native American myth and legend too.

Eventually I hope to reach a point of participatory discussion on just what it is about these anthopomorphic stories, whether text or animated film, that so fascinates some of us and so much repels others. Gary and I have a friend, a fine musician and experienced teacher of preschool kids, who absolutely cannot stand the "talking animal" genre, as he calls it. Disinterest I can understand, but his dislike puzzles me.

[corelog.livejournal.com]

Chanur's Legacy! I remember reading that one. :D Ditto Lewis' "Out of the Silent Planet," though I don't remember that one very well at ALL.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yep. Actually there are five Chanur novels and that was the last. I know I'm not the only one who wishes Cherryh would revisit the honorable Hani, the devious Mahendo'sat, the bizarre Stsho, and those nasty reptilian guys, the Kif. Not to leave out the methane breathing species like the T'ca and the Kzin, whom she barely touches upon.

Out of the Silent Planet is by far my favorite Lewis book, because of the "old furry folk" of Malacandra, the sorns, the pfifltriggi, and most especially, the otter-like hrossa. The races that were unfallen, the like of whom would never come again because once Maleldil took human form on Earth, then forever after all rational beings would have to look like him. (The logic of that escapes me, but the sadness of it is all-encompassing once one has seen the nobility and artistry of the hrossa.) I do love Narnia with its talking animals, of course, and most especially the later books of that series, but the hrossa are among my very favorite characters in all of literature.

[quickcasey.livejournal.com]

Wow, I listened. And I'm sure I have more to learn, than contribute. I'll be back. I trust you'll post just like this when you do another. Nice to hear your voice again.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Hay, thanks for listening. I'm glad to know you think it sounds like me. I'm no sound engineer and it's really hard to judge your own voice anyway. Guess I was somewhere near the right balance.

Yep, I'll post just like this when the next episode is ready. Or if you have an e-mail program that handles RSS feeds, you can subscribe via the XML link above and have the URL for each edition drop into your mailbox automatically.

[moose-93395.livejournal.com]

Well now, that's a very nice start to this series of talks and I already look forward to hearing more from you.
I have a hard time reading about bad stuff happening to equines or cervines so I've only read a few bits of the real Bambi and that was enough to shut that book forever. I suppose it's a little odd that I draw the line there and then I can watch horror films and play the violent sort of video games without a hitch really. Yet for instance Braveheart or The Ring, I can never watch again.
Anyhow I hope I can talk to you soonish about the whole MFF thing.

[calydor.livejournal.com]

You're not the only one who can never watch The Ring again.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Hmm? Since when are you bothered by violence?

[calydor.livejournal.com]

Oh, The Ring isn't -that- violent. It is scary. It is so scary that even I, who managed a good night's sleep after accidentally and unplanned watching a documentary about exorcism followed by a Stephen King thriller, had sleepless nights after watching it.

There are some psychological aspects in it I can't define, and while a certain scene on a ferry in the middle of it shouldn't have been there, the movie itself stands out as a re-definition of the horror genre.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Strange, I must have been tuned out completely because I don't even know to what you are referring here.

Jackson's LotR is often ugly. The imagery is just plain nasty and unpleasant, and he omitted much of the descriptive portion of Tolkien's story that would have been sheer beauty. But there is nothing there I could equate to "horror" and certainly nothing that seems as bizarre to me as Stephen King's imaginings. He turned the story into a Homeric epic. Like the Iliad, just a series of battles and counting coup, with a few idle love scenes tossed in and the hobbits as comic relief.

[calydor.livejournal.com]

You are talking about LotR, Moose and I aren't. We're talking about a horror movie from 2002, about a video tape with some odd imagery, much like an incoherent nightmare, and anyone who watches it dies after exactly seven days. Violently, very violently.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Sounds like some of the "art" videos I had to catalog at my old job. In order to catalog them, one has to watch them. Though I must say, the worst reaction I ever got was headaches and stomach churning. I'm still here.

[calydor.livejournal.com]

Hoh, expect this to be some lame 'art' movie and you are going to get scarred.

I am serious here. I like scary movies. The worst I've ever had in the way of a reaction to one was looking over my shoulder when taking the dog for a walk in a dark forest afterwards.

After watching The Ring I would start sweating nervously if there was a black/white movie on TV (like the video tape) or if I got a static screen (which I won't explain since it's essential to the plot).

Winter is coming, and if you and Gary should want a movie that makes you cuddle up real close to feel safe, rent this one.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I'll take a pass. It would give him nightmares, and I'd just think it was dumb. We've established that before.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Does seem a little odd to me, yes. ;) Videogames to me seem like a culture of violence in which violence is often the only apparent object.

Braveheart was long and boring, though I did manage to watch the whole thing. Rob Roy was a much better production in that vein, I think, though it was nearly as violent and the rape scene particularly repulsive. Peter Jackson's Ring trilogy simply missed the whole point of the books, in my opinion, as film makers are wont to do. I can watch it again for the elements that I think he got right, but much of it has little to do with the story that I believe Tolkien was telling.

Sure, grab me on Taps or e-mail me about MFF. Are you going to be able to go now that you have a new job?

[moose-93395.livejournal.com]

Hmm, oddly enough video games are often a way to relieve stress for me. I do rather like the GTA series as it can quickly turn to rampant chaos and at the same time it's such a parody of society that it's ridiculous, especially the fake radio stations.

I can't watch Braveheart because of how over the top the violence to horses is in it. With "The Ring", again horses are driven insane and kill themselves horribly because of the 'evil'. The movie itself was stupid and not scary to me, just played on cheap tricks and trying to make nonsense into fear.

As for the new Lord of the Rings movie. Well I really like it and I've read the books. Books are almost always going to be better than the films from them but some things simply cannot be made into the film version of a novel and sometimes you have to bend things to be a certain way in order to reach people that can't grasp the book form.

Yes I plan on going, I just hope this job allows me the funds to do so.

[songdogmi.livejournal.com]

Way cool. It's a very clean recording, and your delivery is very clear and authoritative. I'll have to listen again to pick up all the content but what I caught on first listen shows you do know your stuff, which is not at all surprising.

How often will you be doing these? (You might've said...)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I'd like them to be weekly, but to be honest, the amount of research I did in order to write the script for that one suggests it won't happen that frequently. I'll try to make sure they happen at least once a fortnight for a while, though.

I'm quite honestly pleased with the favorable comments, but still curious to see whether I can develop a consistent audience that contributes questions and ideas. And thanks for listening.

Amazingly Wonderful

[pioneer11.livejournal.com]

First of all, you have a tremendously great voice for this
sort of thing, forget podcasts, you should be on the radeeoh daddeeoh.

Secondly this is a really good subject for a 'cast. I've often joked
that my own furry wasn't brought on by Disney but by "19th Century
writers that decided animals could talk".

Along those lines I've attempted, in online roleplay, to try and either
give rational reasons for being anthropomorphic or to play such a
character less anthro and more morphic. That is, if I walk upright
and look like a human with paws and claws, why? If I do /not/ but
have language, then what would that language be like? I'm not sure
but wasn't it Shakespeare that asked, "If a lion spoke, would we
understand him?"

None the less I'm glad that you pointed out that none of the stories
19th century writers created were really intended for adults, though
as history moved on and we became, as people, more cynical and focused
on the machine as the industrial revolution touched everything in life.
Richard Adam's Watership Down is an modern example of such a work
because it has evidence of "animal violence" that isn't usually
in the sort of Disney canon we associate with talking animals.

Personally the work that most evoked the "playground of the mind"
(as Larry Niven puts it) was Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH. Though,
and perhaps this would be best discussed (if at all, its your show
after all 'tivo ^.^ )later on, would be the way the internet has
both enhanced the idea of furry and maybe degraded it. Did furry
evolve to the next level with yiff or was that just a way to use
the genre as a mask for sexuality not otherwise expressible?

Given the choice I'd rather have furry roleplay around online then
not. I've been involved in some stunningly creative worlds and hopefully
injected some of my own.

Just the /idea/ of animals that talk, be they ones that walk upright
or not, is a concept that will probably never cease as long as /we/
walk upright and talk. Its a good thing because it helps us to have
some empathy for the world we inhabit.

Re: Amazingly Wonderful

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Glad you liked it. :)

More will be forthcoming, judging by the generally positive reactions.

Mrs. Frisby will come along in time, along with The Rescuers. Both really were written for children though, and at first I'm looking at stuff written by adults for adults. I think Jack London is my next subject.

Now the larger question of what furry fandom is about and how so much of it degenerated into yiff is a little beyond the scope of my series. That's something I'm curious about, but don't pretend to understand. Literature, though, I have a little background for.

[farhoug.livejournal.com]

The subject turned out to capture my interest even more than I though, and I'll be eagerly waiting for future podcasts. I thought that there hasn't been that much literature on the "furry" genre that has crossed my path, being a bit stuck on fantasy and sci-fi. But still I remember "Watership Down", I think Jack London's "Call of the Wild" was mentioned somewhere here, and "The Wind in the Willows" is currently just next to me waiting to be processed. Oh, Orwell's "Animal Farm" probably fits there somewhere too...

On technical side, that USB microphone gives surprisingly good sound. And of course, your voice is perfect for 'casts, very enjoyable to listen.

*subscribed*

[altivo.livejournal.com]

There's a lot of furry literature to read and discuss. I have here a list of hundreds of titles. Some of them are definitely in the science fiction and fantasy realm, too. I'm glad you plan to be along for the discussion.

I confess I'm a little taken aback by all the comments on my voice. I hadn't thought of it as out of the ordinary, but I'm certainly glad that everyone seems to like it.