Another buncha questions answered

[altivo]

Copied from corelog:

1) Have you ever been arrested, if yes for what?
No, never an actual arrest. And no speeding tickets, though I once got ticketed in Michigan for not wearing goggles with my motorcycle helmet. ;p

2) What kind of drugs have you done?
Tried a couple of times: marijuana, LSD (neither one appealed to me.) I do drink wine or an occasional beer, but I haven't been tipsy, let alone drunk, in so many years that I couldn't guess when the last time was.

3) How many people have you actually slept with?
Slept with as in literally sharing a bed or as in "had sex with" or both? This is a silly question. I've shared a bed with maybe a dozen people in my life, actually was sexual with perhaps half of them. That doesn't count people I had sex with but did not "sleep with" which might be another double handful or so. Way low for a gay male who became sexually aware long before AIDS was known, but... that's me. Very shy, very cautious, very slow.

4) Do you think that people really like you?
Some do and make it clear, some don't but pretend that they do, some just don't.

5) What's the worst thing that you've said to someone?
Every single thing I've ever said that hurt the person I said it to. I can't possibly say any one was worse than another, it's the hurt that matters.

6) What's the one thing that you regret most in your life?
Not enough formal art studies.

7) Have you ever punched someone?
Once. In high school. Never again.

8) Who do you pretend to like the most?
I agree with corelog on this one. Question does not compute.

9) Have you ever made someone cry?
Yes. My parents long ago. My wife when I was married. My mate, myself. All of them in both good ways and bad.

10) Have you ever had a nickname that you hated?
"Gary the Fairy". Used against me by a fellow high school student not for the obvious reason but because he feared me as an academic rival. Competition isn't my nature. He was valedictorian of the class, I was salutatorian. I believe I learned much more than he did, though.

11) Do you really love the person you are with?
Yes. And many others.

12) Have you ever stolen from someone?
Nothing of consequence. I often feel like I've stolen something when I find money or other things people have lost.

13) Your favorite phrase is?
I don't think I have one... do I?

14) Have you ever had a pregnancy scare?
Who? Me? Impossible!

15) Name three people you would fantasize to sleep with?
I will assume this means LJers rather than expecting me to name people who are utterly unknown to likely readers. Hmmm. I guess I should also assume that it means both sleep with and "have sex with"? I'm really too old for most of the people on my friends list to welcome the idea. Let's rule out all the ones whose sexuality I don't know anything about or if I do know it doesn't fit, and all the ones whom I might find attractive but would fear utter rejection or something from. Gee, I can still come up with three, hopefully none of them will want to shoot me for saying it: songcoyote, goldenstallion, shadowtxhorse. There are actually quite a few other candidates, but for lots of reasons I wouldn't feel comfortable naming them here.

16) The weirdest place you've ever had sex?
On a beach at night, only about 200 feet from the well-lighted facade and parking lot of an open restaurant.

17) The kinkiest thing you've ever done?
Had all out sex with my boyfriend in a motel room while my wife was "asleep" in the other bed. *blush* That was a long time ago, and she loved it and we knew she would. Other than that, not much that would shock anyone. Let a boyfriend give me oral while I was driving on the interstate? Once, yes. A couple of three-way things, much enjoyed in fact (both all male.)

18) Have you ever lied at work?
Not explicitly, no. By implication or omission, sure.

19) When was your last speeding ticket?
Never had one.

20) Where would your dream vacation be?
Somewhere with no telephones, radio, or television. Preferably with lots of wildlife or maybe friendly horses (ridable a plus) and spectacular wild scenery. Oh, and probably not alone, though at one time I would have even preferred that.

21) What's the one thing you wish you did in your life?
You mean that I had an opportunity for and didn't do? Though I've turned down a lot of opportunities, I don't think I regret any of them.

22) Do you have any hidden tattoos or piercings that no one knows about?
Nope. My left earlobe is all.

23) What's your biggest pet peeve?
People who react emotionally without thinking at all.

24) What's the nerdiest thing you do?
You mean like checking e-mail and LJ several times a day?

25) Do you talk to yourself when no one else is around?
Quite a bit, not always in English.

26) Do you think you're a good dancer?
Nope. Never had much interest. Loud dance music hurts my ears too much.

27) What's your favorite alcoholic drink?
Red wines from southeastern Australia, without a doubt. Shiraz, merlot, various others.

28) How many does it take to get you drunk?
I've been seriously drunk perhaps twice in my life. I don't know how much I had, but it was too much. I rarely exceed two glasses of wine in an evening.

29) If your world were to end tomorrow, who would you choose to spend your last night with?
The whole world? My mate of course, and my dogs and horses. But there are many others I'd really want to see too.

30) Do you believe in soulmates?
The Platonic ideal match? Yes, actually. But not in the sense that each of us has only one perfect match. There are many, many possible matches.

31) Do you believe in God?
Not the Judeo-Christian-Islamic one, no.

32) Has anybody ever really disappointed you?
Not real seriously. By the time I really trust and put faith in them, they've always lived up to my expectations.

33) Name one person who turned out to not be who you thought they would be?
I'm not at all sure what this means. I don't think a person is anything or anyone until I know who they are, at least to some extent. I don't see how else it could be...without input, how can there be output?

Comments

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

You have a wife and a boyfriend? Wow!

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

He had a wife.

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

Ah, okay. Still, he had both at the same time at one point, that definitely perked my curiosity.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Having a wife and boyfriend at the same time is not all that uncommon, I've found. Unfortunately, among those, I have found it quite rare that a guy has a boyfriend and a wife who know about and accepts it at the same time. Most of the time, from those I know, the husband is simply cheating on her with a guy.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

I, too, had a wife of sorts and a boyfriend simultaneously. I dunno how much you wanna dig into that ... they were both fully aware, but twice in a row, the boyfriend became too jealous and the relationships were called off.

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

That's what I meant was so unique, having a relationship like that where everyone seemed to be happy.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

I actually know a couple women who are open to open realtionships.

I do not get jealous, but when it comes to actual sexual play, I've found I do not like anything more than one on one. I invariably feel like a third wheel on a motorcycle. I definitely can love in my heart more than one ... I wonder if that's related to the range and multiple of characters I like to roleplay simultaneously that seems a bit baffling to my RP friends like altivo who only seem to be able to handle one or two characters at a time.

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

I've been able to RP upwards of five characters at a time, myself, though it's a TON of extra work.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Simultaneously as in all logged in at the same time?

I had six ... and all of them not only logged in and RPing at once, but in the same scene.

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

I usually RP on IM programs, as MUCKS tend to make things overly complicated. Otherwise, I've done up to three characters in a MUCK, and up to five with more freestyle (basically posing what they're all doing in the same line).

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Odd, I find IMs to be highly limited. MUSHes are generally much better suited to freestyle RP than MUCKs, but yeah they do have a learning curve. I've had single poses exceed two screenfuls on a MUSH. A MUCK can't do that even if its designed more for RP than the social stuff most MUCKS seem to be, because its buffer can't hold that much. None of the IM clients I have would support that length, either.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Really though, poses like that are just too long. It amounts to monopolizing the stage, if nothing else, and it makes it too difficult for your RP partners to process what you are doing and interact with it in a timely manner. I really do think ten lines or less is much more sensible under most conditions.

I agree with you about IM programs. I'm puzzled by people who say they prefer them for RP. For chatting, sure, OK. But they don't have sufficient flexibility for RP and in general don't allow more than two people to interact at a time. IRC is more workable, but still lacks the freedom you get from MUSH/MUCK type servers.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Those pose lengths were with Running Wind who reciprocated in kind, actually, and also on SpheresMUX when they, too, were reciprocated with poses of similar span.

I really think MUSHes are ideal for RPing. PBEMs might be a close second, but I haven't played one in awhile.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

PBEM is analogous, I think, to the RP situation I'm currently being offered. The difference is that instead of e-mail, I think the intention is to use something like a PHP-based forum environment.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Speaking of which, I proposed a sort of template for the character pages on the WSM wikifur pages, on the Discussion section. I am very newbish on wikiing, but I think it'd be nice to adopt a standard template for all the character pages to make them all look consistent.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I posted a comment to your suggestion there. While a more detailed structure for character pages seems like a good idea, there is an overall pattern to Wikifur too and character pages can apply to many different environments. In many cases, an individual character appears in multiple environments, so their page should fit with all of those (as, for instance, 'Tivo appears on FurryMUCK, Tapestries, and IRC, in addition to his original Wild Spirits setting.)

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

I don't suppose you (or anyone reading this) happened to save any of my characters' descriptions of +finger info?

All of my logfiles from WS, and the past couple years, seem to have vanished unfortunately. :/ I thought I had them safely archived, but I've done an extensive file search for them (I kept them consistently named) and came up with nada. :/ (no, I don't want the Night That Never Happened log ...)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I probably have some. Finding them is a big job though. I'll watch as I'm digging through the stuff.

I don't have the night that never was either, and I was sure I did originally have it.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

If there's room for one more, I'd like to try it out.

Honestly, I probably won't be able to revive my characters. I'm sure you'd be disappointed to hear that in regards to Ironhoof. :p With her, I'd wait for the right environment with administration and players that would be open to her, and I'm also concerned about her canon since I'm now writing novels about her life.

With the other characters, like Terrayme I think you probably liked most, unfortunately its been too long. I've forgotten the 'feel' of her and the others, and I fear in trying to play them again, I'd get a 'feel' that wasn't the same, and the spirit of the characters wouldn't be the same. Kinda hard to explain.

Colorado might be an interesting character to bring in, since he's relatively fresh and eager to stretch his paws for some RP ... if you could stomach a vegetarian wolf there. And, of course, other new characters.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I'll remember that, but it's not mine to say who gets asked. I suspect the intention is a fairly defined plotline with specific characters, and I'm still not certain I will fit myself.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Hmmm. I have done FCs before, but of course its up to them.

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

That seems like a bit much to pose in one shot, though... and wouldn't it take like a half hour for someone to read it all and respond right back? At that point, it seems less immersive and more like you're collaborating to write a novel. Just my honest opinion.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

There are elements of collaborative writing, yes. Those poses are extreme though, as I pointed out. Four to eight lines is much more typical, and quite workable. It can be extremely absorbing, and challenging. And the result can be quite rewarding, worth saving and polishing in fact.

You need to see three or four fairly good RPers going at it to appreciate what it can be, I think. I'll take a look through my logs and see if I can find a suitable example for you. :)

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

All right, sounds good! Of course, if there are really three or four people writing eight lines or more each, it seems like there would be a lot of continuity and timing issues. Then again, I also save all of my roleplays and polish them up into actual writing, or at least keep ideas in the back of my mind for future writings (crediting the other person or people for helping me be so inspired, of course).

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Here's an example I just happen to have online and available.

Tivo's first meeting with Imperator

That took place on Tapestries MUCK, and is fairly straightforward, just two characters posing alternately. I'll hunt up an example of multiple characters for you shortly. In essence, with three or more you take turns. When your turn comes up if you have little to say you can insert some minor pose of a few words in order to pass the turn on. Don't be put off by the flowery language in my little scene with Imp. We get into that sometimes, but it's a bit extreme compared to everyday stuff.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Actually only 10 to 20 minutes usually, we were fairly fast typists.

I used to think it was sort of a collaborative novel, but I've since come to realize that a novel written like RP is a bad novel. There's simply a lot more there, a lot of characters' personal thoughts and such to reflect their differing perspectives and reactions to what other characters are doing. Sometimes its been monologuish, sometimes its a character being very indecisive or fighting hard against a decision they don't want to make but must anyway.

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

Fascinating! ^^

[altivo.livejournal.com]

There might be a connection, though I think it more likely that my RP style is related to my stage acting experience and methods. It's the personal furry thing, or type casting. I do very well in roles that match my own personality, and have no wish to tackle those that are far off. My favorite roles that I played on stage were Benjamin the Donkey in Orwell's Animal Farm and Philip II of France in Goldman's The Lion in Winter. If you know those plays, you'll see the parallels immediately I think.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

Its hard to pin if there is a causal event or anything, but I was prodded by my instructors in high school to debate. One of my absolute favorite teachers of all time, Mrs. Northington, was a black southern lady who was my instructor in my regular junior year English class and an AP Literature class she placed me into in my senior year. There was no "axing questions" from this lady; she was very well-read and eloquent. During my AP English class from her, she had the class act things out to try and gain understanding of things that seem so far removed from us ... one such event was slavery, and she challenged me to take the side of the slave owners, to try and truly understand them.

She knew quite well that I was very liberal minded, and the concept of slavery was highly repulsive to me, but she wanted me to know their perspective. There were several more debates on other things in class, and every time she challenged me to take the side I personally did not agree with.

I did try my paw at stage acting in high school, but unfortunately I had incurable stage fright, probably thanks to a combination of my fear of crowds and my General Anxiety disorder I was diagnosed with a few years back.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

It's possible. In fact, more complex arrangements are quite possible. Check out the topic of polyamory on the web and here on LJ. However, as with so many things, the complexity increases exponentially. My little menage only worked out for a few months with everyone happy. I lost the boyfriend first, because I wasn't gay enough for him. My depression over that sent the marriage itself into a downward spiral, in part because my wife continued to see him and his new mate socially, while it was still too painful for me to be around them.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Actually it may be more common than you realize for the wife to be aware and at least tolerant. Or it was, pre-AIDS. There seems to be a kind of double-think that says it doesn't count if it's just another man, where another woman would not be tolerated.

We came of age sexually in the 60s. Attitudes were a lot looser then. It is really true that politics and sexual attitudes go hand in hand. The end of the Vietnam debacle and the resignation of Richard Nixon heralded an era of liberal attitudes toward everything, including sexuality and child rearing. But the Reagan years reversed most of that, and the onset of the AIDS epidemic threw ice water over the whole thing.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

My experience has only been over the past 9 years or so, and in that time its been my experience from my observations that a lot more common for gay men to cheat on their wives and fiances, and kept their wife/fiance in the dark.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

This may have always been the more common situation, actually.

[corelog.livejournal.com]

For the perspective of someone else in a place like that, you could always ask me. You already know me and my ex had a very wide separation in age. What I don't know if I've mentioned yet is that he is also married. His wife knew about everything, was fine with everything...and I -thought- I was fine with everything. But for reasons of my own, of which that was only one influence, I had to leave that relationship.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

*grin*

OK, well I don't need to ask I think. But that's an interesting bit of information just the same.

[corelog.livejournal.com]

Well, I didn't mean you so much as I meant Danji, but of course you're always able to ask anything you want as well. :)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I figured you meant Danji. I have never been on the other side of that coin, both because I was never really offered the opportunity and because I think I'd have said "No thanks" from the start. The truth is, I'd never have put anyone into that position either. It was created, in fact, through a sort of conspiracy between my wife and the boyfriend. Altogether an odd story, I think, but I was (and am) much to shy and reticent to have initiated that relationship.

As far as that goes, the marriage was a similar thing. She and I had been dating and eventually were lovers for a long time. She went away to graduate school in New York, and after the first year of her two year program, came back to Michigan to visit (spurning her family in Pennsylvania, as a matter of fact) and to say to me "Well, unless we're getting married, I think there's probably no reason for me to come back here any more." Heh. "So sure," I said, "Let's get married next year after you graduate." And we did. It was bizarre from many points of view and really no surprise that it didn't last long term.

Eventually she told me that she was attracted to me because she thought I was probably gay (I didn't know it myself at the time.) So in a way, I was a toy for her curiosity. She picked John out from the Gay Liberation group on campus, arranged for us to meet (without my realizing anything about what she had in mind) and just sort of created private romantic situations for the two of us until something happened. I still feel pretty stupid about it, but I don't blame her. I fell into the trap, after all. I wasn't pushed, just urged along.

[heavens-steed.livejournal.com]

What?! He was married when you two were together? I can't believe that. It was bad enough he never told me he was married and then I found that out, but that he was married when you two were together? I am not happy about this knowledge.

I'm glad you did break up with Jim if that was case. If you chose to continue a relationship with someone who is married, you would have deserved a good slapping. Aye, what else am I going to find out?

[corelog.livejournal.com]

...

Oyvey, he's going to hate me for being such a revealing source of information. X( He would have told you these things himself, in time...I'm just always jumping the gun.

*sigh* Be that as it may...why can you not believe it? And keep in mind that my prior ability to not handle it was only one factor in the whole shebang. One part of the overwhelming reason, which was that I felt that I would always be his inferior, without him even meaning to make me feel that way. He wanted us to be equals, and yet he is of such strong opinions and such great experience, that I couldn't help but feel inferior.

In contrast, Hunter too has strong opinions and great experience. The difference is that Hunter doesn't keep it in the visible present. It's there, he just doesn't show it as visibly, and that allows me to focus on who he is for who he is, rather than who he is because of what he's done. Jim has no qualms about showing off everything he's got, and if you can't deal with it, that's too bad. An attitude he was not willing to compromise, even for me. I admire his fortitude, even if I don't agree with some of what he applies it to.

Hunter's experience and knowledge helped form who he is today. So has Jim's. But Jim keeps it more up front and in your face, whereas Hunter only brings it up when relevant. Makes all the difference in allowing me to feel like an equal.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Had. That was a long time ago. I was married for three years when I was still in my 20s and didn't know any better.

[duraji-synth.livejournal.com]

Wow... I just looked up your birthday in your userinfo... holy cow, I how absolutely no idea you were that age... you sure fooled me! You come across as so happy and youthful in your persona here... yet you're older than my mother! O_O (please don't take offense to that!)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

No offense taken. I do have some gray hair. But you are only old if you think you are old. :)

[heavens-steed.livejournal.com]

Promiscious, three-somes, a boyfriend and a wife? Tivo, you are not as innocent as I thought you were. I am, in fact, disillusioned. For some one who has been with another person for so long, and is so cautious and "not very sexual", yet I see a different Tivo painted here. I feel like I've been deceived.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Finrod, love, in the context of modern American life, I have lived like a monk. Other than my mate, I have been sexually active with no one in at least 24 years. The time period covered by my honest answers to those questions was 1970-1980, when I was in my 20s.

For someone who was that age at that time, and a gay male, you could say I was practically celibate. In fact, I was often accused of precisely that. I'm sorry that you feel I deceived you in some way, but really, I have said nothing untrue, nor have I hidden anything.

Seriously, now, at that time, when I may have had sexual contact with as many as, gosh, three people in a year's span, the typical active gay male living in an urban environment was said to average 100 or more partners a year. This is difficult even for me to imagine, and I lived through the era, so I realize it may be incredible from your perspective. I assure you, though, it's somewhere near the truth.

I don't think it is fair or accurate for you to call me "promiscuous" in that context. I have never been so. Yes, I am open to more possibilities than straight-laced Christians are, or at least more than they usually admit to. I do not condemn what others do, but I have very careful standards for myself. The things that happened while I was married took place because my wife wanted them to, very much in fact. She encouraged it, almost begged and pleaded sometimes. We both got hurt as a result, because we were both too young and inexperienced to understand what we were doing, but it works for some people and is OK. I would not do the same thing again, in the same way. Much of the rest of what seems promiscuous to you was just a decade of trying, hoping, to find a life partner, to not be alone in a hostile world, to have someone to share with. Eventually, I succeeded, but it is far from unusual to have some false starts along that road, and especially so for gay men who have to deal with a lot more baggage and negative pressure. That has eased a bit since those days, but we are still not safe from persecution and the efforts of US culture to drive us apart.

The total number of people with whom I have been physically sexual to some degree is probably somewhere between ten and twenty. For an American male of my age, straight or gay, I think that is way below average. For a gay male, especially one who became self aware in the 1960s in the US, it is astonishingly low, believe it or not. I have certainly never misrepresented myself to you or to anyone else.

[heavens-steed.livejournal.com]

Well, you judge yourself by standards that are lower than mine. Given the context you gave me and other facts, I can see that, yes, for a young gay male, you were quite cautious and tame.

I am sorry. I may have overreacted. To judge and look at someone through the eyes of the past is not necessarily the wisest thing to do and it was a little unfair. Who we were in the past doesn't necessarily make us who we are now. I just always saw you as someone who could truly commit himself and valued sex in the context of a committed and intimiate relationship, something that is extremely rare among homosexual males and I really respected and admired that about you. To see you acting like everyone else was disillusioning, but that was the past.

I never stopped liking you, dear. You still mean much to me and you are a wonderful person. Please forgive me.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

There is nothing to forgive but I forgive you anyway. Well, that may sound arrogant, but you know what I mean, I hope.

No, I don't have the same standards you do, but you knew that already. And truthfully, I see what seems to be a lot of suffering and self-hatred as a result of your extremely high standards. Even Jesus, in what I can see of him in the gospels, didn't hold people to those kind of standards. Not at all. Neither did the saint whom, though in many ways he seems to have been a bit crazy, I admire the most: Francis of Assisi.

[heavens-steed.livejournal.com]

And truthfully, I see what seems to be a lot of suffering and self-hatred as a result of your extremely high standards

Oh yes, I agree with you there. But Jesus holds us to the highest standards. "Be perfect as your heavenly father is perfect." The difference is that He is understanding, patient, and forgiving.

[corelog.livejournal.com]

Even in the past, I wouldn't call Tivo promiscuous. Not celibate either, but not promiscuous.

But what is past is in the past and is not in the present. Who you were is no longer who you are. Who I was is no longer who I am. Did you think Tivo was always innocent? Did you think that your definitions applied to him with a certainty?

I'm not upset at all, as I understand how these things can happen. But I think you judge Tivo a little harshly, my dear. Do you think I was always so well-balanced (how Jim would laugh at hearing me say that, even now!)? To put not too fine a point on it, I used to be a little shit. Arrogant, proud, attention-seeking, and blind. I don't want to be respected for who I was--I want to be respected for who I am now.

I think you may have made a well-meaning, often-encountered mistake in putting Tivo on a platform or pedastal. Nobody today is everything they were yesterday. Since those days, Tivo has gained much wisdom. He has also lost some other attributes, no matter what you choose to call them (and I still think promiscuity is still a bit of a reach).

Understand what Tivo has said. Learn from it, even if it involves some disillusionment. But when all is said and done, I firmly believe that you will also be able to put it behind you (in the past, where it belongs) and realize that the Tivo you thought you knew is still the Tivo that is here with us now. The history revealed is just that--history. It does not alter who he is today. The Tivo we know and love is the one right here. Who is your friend and loves you, just as I am and do.