Civil War Recreations

[altivo]

Soooo... Today Gary was scheduled to provide music at a Civil War Recreation Campsite in Marengo. I've never gone near one of those, because the military stuff is of little interest to me and I really, really dislike the noise of fireworks or gunfire. He promised me that the shooting wouldn't start until after 1 pm, so I stopped by briefly about 11 am to see what it was like. Admission was free, so fine.

Well, I guess its a harmless enthusiasm like any other, but I don't think I'll ever quite "get" it. The US Civil War (or The War Between the States as the southern faction prefers to call it) was the bloodiest war in which the United States ever engaged, and had the highest number of casualties (obviously, since both sides were the same nation.) It was extremely ugly, and left tears in the fabric of our culture and society that have never been completely healed. Somehow I can't understand getting excited about it to the point of reenacting it, enthusiastically dressing up in copies of old uniforms and firing 150 year old weapons (or replicas) at each other. To me it is a terrible event from which we should learn and which we should remember with mourning, not something to perpetuate and celebrate.

But anyway, I met a few of Gary's friends who do this thing, saw their encampment and period clothing, tents, etc. I have to say, the only thing that really interested me was the horses. Of course, they ride with period tack, too, which means McClelland style saddles and rather nasty-looking curb bits. The saddles look kind of like a leg hold trap for a bear, minus teeth, opened out on the horse's back. The rider sits right over where the trigger should be. It looks horribly uncomfortable. I think I'd rather recreate the Indian wars that followed a decade or two later, but only if I could be on the Indians' side and ride without a saddle. Ugh.

The horses were pretty though, and now I finally understand what a "picket line" was. I got out of there well before the phony hostilities began.

Comments

[daikitsune.livejournal.com]

The point of civil war re-enactments isn't to celebrate the war, nor to perpetuate it. Do you see any fights breaking out between the Union and Confederate camps? Anyone getting injured? Now, I can't speak for the events you've been to, but the ones I attended when I was younger were meant to be a reminder of a terribly bloody part of our history as a country. People stared into the eyes of their enemies in those days, sometimes people they knew or family who ended up on the other side of a battle...

There aren't many better ways to teach people - especially young people - about a historical event than to get them involved in some way. We had people who spoke not just about a doctor's experience during the war, but from the point of view of one of those doctors. We had people speaking about their "lives" as soldiers, sometimes directly quoting diaries and notes from the war. We had solemn moments to remember entire cities destroyed, dead bodies two men deep fallen on the battlefield...

Also, there were usually other sections of an event, places to sample traditional recipes, or to see how society was structured, the styles of dress, the way things worked in the late 19th century. I spoke with a lot of people who were deeply curious about the war, and we were able to put it into a bit of a better perspective for them. You can't truly recreate the horrors of war for people, but if you draw them in and create even a slightly realistic setting for them, you have an amazing opportunity to teach to an open mind.

That's why I used to be a reenactor.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

The point of civil war re-enactments isn't to celebrate the war, nor to perpetuate it.

I agree this should be so. But it's my perception that for many, perhaps most, participants, that in fact becomes the point. Tony Horwitz thought so too in his book Confederates in the Attic.

I did the SCA thing when I was an undergraduate, and felt the same frustration. In theory, the study of history through recreation is a valid kind of archeology, and much can be learned from it. In practice, though, it invariably seems to degenerate into a kind of spectator sport and that's what I have a lot of trouble with. In the particular case of the Civil War, one has only to talk with the reenactors to realize that a significant number of them are indeed still fighting the war on some internal level.

[daikitsune.livejournal.com]

You do have some points there. I mean, as a reenactor I have to say there was plenty of stuff after the crowd was gone that was more entertainment than education. It basically turned into a campout in an unusal spot, with drinking, a bit of rowdiness, and old style dancing.

I didn't really notice too many cases of people having issues with the "other side" (at least while out of character), except for at the big reenactment down in Shiloh. There were some issues there, but pretty few considering there were over 2000 reenactors in attendance.

Perhaps I was just lucky enough to end up with groups at events where it wasn't so much of a problem. Perhaps I was just naive and didn't see it. But my experience was very positive, and I know I learned and taught a lot. :)

[songdogmi.livejournal.com]

During the time I was almost into reenacting, all the people I knew "did" Civil War. That was a bummer because I have always been more interested in the fur trade (mid-1700s to early 1800s), but I ended up learning a lot about reenacting from the Civil War folks, especially at the reenactments held at Historic Fort Wayne. A lot of my friends were women who recreated the non-war aspects, but that's about all women were allowed to do during the war itself, of course. They were pretty good at "performing" and drawing the mundanes in. Then afterwards, they had good stories about the dumber mundanes asking "is that food real?" when they did camp cooking demos. :)

A few of them were getting into World War I after a while. I never did get wanting to reenact a 20th century war. There's NO way to romanticize any part of trench warfare, as far as I'm concerned.

It's not surprising the horses would be a high point of the event for you. That would be very interesting even to me. The events I went to never had much cavalry to speak of. Some of the events had some good musical enactments; that tended to draw my attention.

I never have really managed reenacting myself. The biggest part was that I didn't know any fur traders and would've been too shy if I did have real opportunities to meet them. I went to a couple of events a year for a few years and had fun as a mundane. Did manage to pull some early American garb together, but it's not field tested by any means.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I know there are Revolutionary War reenactors and French and Indian Wars reenactors. Fur traders is a new concept to me, though that's a historical period in which I have considerable interest too. The only thing I've seen that might be called reenactment for that is the groups who sing voyageur songs, like the Northland College men's choir.

Geography has something to do with these interests, of course. Illinois was a big participant in the Civil War, and because of its geography and varied economy had sympathizers on both sides. And of course, horses would be easier to come by for reenactment out here than they are in some areas. The horse population of McHenry County is quite high (guess why I live here?)

I suspect interest in voyageurs or French and Indian Wars would come naturally in areas that were more actively involved in those activities, which means, I guess, the upper Great Lakes and Canadian border states. Having been born and raised in Michigan, I'm much aware of that era, but folks here give you a blank look if you happen to mention it.

[songdogmi.livejournal.com]

I'm not exactly sure how fur trade reenacting came about, since the high point of the fur trade (1810-1840)* came at a time the country was not in a big war. Maybe it was all the people who watched Jeremiah Johnson and The Life and Times of Grizzly Adams in the 1970s who decided it would be fun to play fur trapper. Or maybe it was around before the movies and that's what caused Hollywood to see a market for the movies (and hire techincal consultants who looked as good or better in buckskins than Redford and Haggerty).

It's very true that the geography plays a big role, and it doesn't surprise me that mundanes of the prairies would be confoozled by the idea of the F&I War, even though the outcome of the war made a big difference all the way along the Mississippi River (as in who the U.S. bought the land from later on). Horses were never terribly convenient when the northern Great Lakes were wild -- something about all those trees -- so that's probably why we don't see 'em much in our reenactments now.

The interesting thing about the Rev.War reenactments I've been to is that when it came time for the obligatory battle, the announcers always had to tell the spectators that there was never a battle fought on Michigan soil between the British and the rebels. Which made me wonder why they never recreated Pontiac's War instead. <evil grin>

*There was 1812, of course, but for all intents it's an offshoot of RevWar reenacting to do 1812. Plus you need boats for all the naval battles -- and you thought horses were expensive.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I don't think I ever saw Grizzly Adams. I'm very familiar with Jeremiah Johnson though. Redford aside (and I admit I've usually liked him) it was the scenery and cinematography that just flattened me. Gorgeous scenery. I can watch the film just for that. The same is true of the relatively recent The Last of the Mohicans, the one with Daniel Day-Lewis as Hawkeye (plus that one has a magnificent music sound track.)

Yeah, I've not heard of much 1812 reenactment, and I'm sure the naval battles are the main reason it doesn't happen. Chief Pontiac's War would be interesting, but were would you find enough Indians? XD

[flaredragon.livejournal.com]

I'm with you on this one.. (amazing, we agree on something? X) ) I can't stand re-enactment stuff in general. It's too fake for me. If they wanted to put true terror into themselves and the people around them, they'd put period authentic bullets into those guns and you know, actually fight. But, thats not going to happen.

Everyone gets their kicks somehow, so I can't bash that. When I lived in massachusetts they used our back yard (we live on the town common, registered historic landmark 1729 Sutton MA) for a re-enactment camp. God, I wanted to pummel someone down so badly, I was furious! But then someone brought horses, and I was too entranced to care much past that.

My thoughts run along similar lines for the SCA, but thats a different story. I am looking forward to fighting one of my friends who goes to their events though... heh heh heh. *grins*

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I think we actually agree about a lot of things. :)

Historic reenactment is a useful way of studying many things, a kind of living archeology. There are people in all these groups who do things that I respect a great deal, and who become experts on the history, culture, and so forth of the time period. Unfortunately, there are a lot of hangers on and hooligans too, for whom it is nothing more than a spectator sport or a commercial venture. That's where I think it starts to go wrong.

I was involved in SCA at one time. Today I feel they have strayed much too far from their original stated purpose. The various war reenactment groups haven't wandered quite so far... yet. However, I think I see the signs that they will, and that more and more participants have. That's what bothers me most. In the case of the Civil War, there really are people involved in this who take it seriously and are using it as a rallying point to keep alive the same arguments and disagreements that caused the original war. That's the really unhappy thing.

[kakoukorakos.livejournal.com]

It's funny...I was just debating the debacle in Iraq with my dad last night. He attempted to cite some foreign policy advisor from Clinton's administration who's allegedly said that the sectarian fighting is "just the way Arabs negotiate, once they shed enough blood to avenge deaths, it'll settle down." Of course, I think that's probably complete crap. And I pointed out that if sectarian strife is "negotiating over the direction of the new government", then the US Civil War was a tariff "negotiation" between the North and the South.

I think US Civil War re-enactments are just fine as long as lots of Chocolate Schnapps are involved. But to explain the cosplay, it seems to me like it's just another form of SCA-type geekery. I view it as big kids playing soldier, and can see how it would be fun to learn history, adopt a persona, and put together an accurate costume.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yes, it's like the SCA, and has all the same flaws and features. I recommend the book Confederates in the Attic by Tony Horwitz for some interesting insights into that.

As for Arab culture, it's true that there are things going on there that we don't always recognize, though I wouldn't put it quite that way. The rivalries between individual leaders do take a form of one-upmanship that perpetuates the skirmishing. I'm sure there's even a correct Arabic word for the specific kind of prestige that chieftains or warlords accumulate. C. J. Cherryh called it sfik when describing the Kif race, whose social structure is obviously modeled on that of the desert bedouins. The various subgroups seek to outdo one another in their raids or attacks both on their own groups and on powerful outsiders, like European or US interests or citizens. Another way of looking at it is by comparing it to the plains Indian tribe practice of "counting coup." It is deeply ingrained in the culture, and won't go away easily.

[kakoukorakos.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that's about the only way the "Arab" cultures seem to be able to negotiate, but it *is* technically a civil war until one side is in control and everyone else submits. And anyone who rebels is quickly and harshly dealt with. I don't think it's accurate to call the sectarian strife in Iraq anything other than a low-grade civil war, which is bound to flare-up when the US leaves. I don't even trust the military we're training for them, odds seem to be good the soldiers' primary loyalty will remain to their tribes, and fooling around over there is like dancing on the proverbial powder keg. There would be potential for success behaving like a colonial power and beating EVERYONE into submission until they get used to a halfway civilized life and power structure. Even that wouldn't have particularly good odds of success, though.

Incidentally, McClellan saddles (well, knock-offs) were extremely popular in the endurance-riding set over a decade ago, and probably still are. They're one of the best-designed saddle in terms of light weight and comfort for the horse, and not too horrible for the rider either (not that the US Cavalry really cared about the riders' comfort all that much though, they were easily enough replaced). Most modern endurance saddles are still pretty similar to those even if they're higher-tech and padded. Most sport a minimal cantle and pommel, vertical leg position (less fatigue for the rider), rigid trees to distribute the weight more evenly across the horse's back (English saddles are minimal, but are flimsy and prone to pressure points that would be bad if used for more than a few hours at a time).

US-military curb bits had relatively long shanks, but at least they had very mild ports. Some of the "vaquero" and other western show-bits have insanely large ports, they make me cringe. I do like curbs in general though, I think snaffles just suck (seems like it can't be that comfortable to have the corners of one's mouth stretched like that!). I tend to go for short-shanks that could almost pass as military Pelhams, my favorites are Argentine snaffles and similar (with the snaffle rings unused most of the time). In the end, it's not how severe the bit is, it's how heavy the rider's hands are.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I certainly agree that Iraq is now in a state of civil war, just as Vietnam was for the last few years before Nixon finally called it quits. I think it's hard for westerners to perceive because we tend to think of all Islam as a monolith, when in fact it is broken up into factions who are even more intolerant of each other than the factions within Christianity are. And that's pretty bad. (The variations within Buddhism are even greater, but these days they tend not to make war on each other. Different lifestyle.)

I've never actually tried riding a McClellan. It looks so uninviting that I've not been tempted at all. My own saddle is an Australian style that is neither Western nor English. It has no horn and a low cantle, but does have a rigid tree and heavy padding between the tree and the horse's back. The padding is supposed to conform to different horses to some extent. The English-like girth is double buckled, and one pair of buckles goes to a strap that passes over the seat. Stirrups look like English, but are adjusted long so that your knee barely bends enough to let you post if you choose to. It's the most comfortable saddle I've ever ridden, and feels much more secure than even most Western ones I've tried.

I generally use the plain snaffle because that's what I have always had. You're right about the rider's hands mattering more than the bit, but I don't trust myself with any but the mildest of curbs. If I bought a new bit today I'd look for a Tom Thumb type, the one that's jointed like a snaffle but has very short shanks and can take a curb strap. The trouble is, my Haflingers have wide mouths, and the selection of bits available in 5-1/2 inch width at a reasonable price is much smaller than what you can get in 5 inches. My mare, Tess, could take a 5-1/4 but a 5 is too small even for her. Fortunately she's fine with neck reining and a loose rein and loose bit is OK for my lazy kind of riding.

[kakoukorakos.livejournal.com]

Argentine snaffles, assuming you can find one that's large enough, are a lot like Tom Thumb, they have the broken mouthpiece and short shanks and curb strap (if desired).

I like Austrailian saddles too, and my next saddle probably would be another Aussie (went with a straight-up synthetic jumping saddle for polo), since the higher-end models tend to have the best of both English and Western worlds.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Now that's eclectic. Argentine snaffle with Australian tack, I like it. I'll have to take a look. I've actually meant to try Tess with a bosal and no bit at all. I think she'd take to it quickly enough, but I haven't found a mecate that I like and can afford yet. (And, I admit, haven't found enough time for riding lately.)

You play polo? Eep. I'm way outclassed.

[chibiabos.livejournal.com]

I'm a bit surprised, actually, that you'd regard it so. Would you rather we forgot the lesson? Or that the Union hadn't fought it, and let the Confederate rebels continue?

Granted, we could do without our current Texan having his trigger-happy fingers on the big red buttons to launch nukes ...

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I am not entirely sure that the Civil War had a winning side. Nor am I entirely sure that it had to happen the way it did.

But no, of course I don't think we should forget it. My point is that if we "celebrate" it in the wrong manner, we forget what it was really like, what it was about, and what the lessons were. Instead, it just becomes a sporting event and an excuse for a little entertainment and a picnic in the park.

When you talk to the reenactors themselves, it seems that many of them are still taking sides over the issues and don't consider the matter settled at all. It's yet another polarizing force in our society, one that is suffering badly from polarization already.

[songdogmi.livejournal.com]

The question might be, are the lessons being taught? I'm trying to remember from the Civil War events I saw, and I'm not sure they really emphasized them. Then again, the better Civil War events would probably be in the areas where the war was fought. Up in Michigan we just conscripted soldiers and then trained them. (Doesn't stop them from having mock skirmishes at the events, though.)

Some of my friends were very interested in teaching observers about the life-ways. A couple of them recreated the Michigan Sanitary Commission, which tried to improve hygiene in battle camps -- so part of their schtick was to tell spectators about all the nasty diseases that could have happened. But I did see a lot of participants who seemed to just want to be cannon fodder, though.

No, the more I think of it, I don't think there were any bigger lessons imparted at the events I went to. I agree with you, that was missing the opportunity to do more than just entertain.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I saw attempts at teaching, including some that I'd label more as misinformation than anything else. I wasn't there for any of the big events, so I don't know how they are presented, or if there is interpretation for the public at all. Evidently this particular recreation is on its last year. The park district where it was held is pinched for money and has raised the costs so high that they won't be coming back.

[pioneer11.livejournal.com]

The sound of gunfire doesn't bother me much, unless
I'm eating, then I get indegstion and...

But as far as horses go in war.

Warhorses are scary to me.

Most times, if you fire off a few rounds near
horses they run away.

Warhorses look at you like your some little
fool.

"Go ahead boy, point that at me and I'll trample
you into the mud"

@.@

*points it somewhere else*

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yes, and they've been known to do that trampling even AFTER being shot if the bullet didn't hit an immediate vital spot. It's good that you know who deserves respect! ;p

On the other hand, I presume you know the story from (I think) the Second Crusade, where the Turks were riding mares and the Europeans were riding stallions (of course, you can't let a masculine Christian male ride a mare) and some of the Turks' mares were in heat... There was no stopping that charge once it started. XD

[(Anonymous)]

*laughs*

I imagine the riders all throw to the ground, standing
with swords ready...and....

*horses going at it*

The warriors sigh and go home.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Well, as the story goes, the first time it was a route for Saladin's troops. But the next time they deliberately used a couple of mares as bait and drew off half the Christian knights into an ambush...

[cabcat.livejournal.com]

I read some of what happened in those prison camps and it gave me the freaking heebie jeebies to say the least.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

The capacity of humans for abusing each other exceeds the limits of my imagination or understanding.