Sigh, it's getting worse everywhere

[altivo]

We went out shopping this afternoon. First to Farm & Fleet to get wild bird foods and so I could peruse shoes that are on sale. They are holding a half price clearance on a lot of shoes, and though I don't care for most of their offerings, I found a pair of plain black tie ups in a good size for a price that can hardly be beat ($22.50) considering that they were actual leather and rubber rather than synthetic materials, and made by the store's work clothes provider whose quality is generally high. My normal work shoes have been starting to come apart at the seams, so this was a required purchase. I also got a nice pair of leather sandals to replace my old ones that were losing their soles.

Then we went to the Evil Empire to get groceries for the week, since we just can't afford our local grocer any more. Did all right in terms of finding most of what I wanted, though as usual the produce department was vile. The asparagus needed to all be thrown in the trash, as it was wilting to slime and growing mold, for instance. We bought the bare minimum there, which is going to be fine in the summer since we garden anyway and there are farmer's markets, but it will be an issue when winter returns. I require fresh fruit and vegetables.

The cashier was nice enough, but even though I'd estimate her age as somewhere near 30, she didn't know lettuce from cabbage, had no idea what broccoli was, and couldn't figure out how to ring up the sweet corn since it goes not by weight but by number of ears purchased. I'd say this is incredible, except it's becoming commonplace.

Comments

[quickcasey.livejournal.com]

Your experience with the cashier was like my helping with the water pump on an old friend's car last weekend. The car's owner was under the impression that the people behind the counter actually work on their own cars. Our old time parts places have been bulldozed under to make room for strip malls, and condos. These kids now just sell you parts. Most of them wouldn't know what to do with them. Hank wanted to share some experience with them, and got blank stares.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yes, that's the situation. Though everybody eats and I rather expect everyone to know an apple from a pear. These days, I ap-pear to be wrong.

This is a salesman's world.

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

Welcome to the world of salesmen. They used to go door-to-door (like the homeless, only they stink less), then they started calling you at home or advertising on late-night infomercials...

Now they are everywhere, training everyone to think, talk and act like them. Actual skills pale in comparision to being able to sell someone a cellphone, exercise machine, or the latest junk food product.

Soon, they will appear in your dreams- lurching at you like zombies, moaning phrases like "seize the sale". How long can you hold out until you take a sales position? How long until you start "selling yourself"? There's no escape! Muhahahahahahah!!!

[equusmaximus.livejournal.com]

Sometimes it makes you wonder if it's stupidity, a lack of training, an "I Don't Care" Attitude, or a combination of any or all of the above. With the Economy in a tailspin you'd think people would be a little more careful and want to keep their job, but perhaps that's just my naive way of thinking.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

In the case of WalMart, keeping the job probably doesn't rely on knowing this stuff. Instead it depends on "not rocking the boat" and always complying with demands related to work schedule without question. And above all, don't dare mention the word "union" where anyone can hear you.

[atomicat.livejournal.com]

*SIGH* Bad, but not astro-bad. Recently posted this link to the worlds most depressing book (other than "You killed Santa, you bastard!"

http://www.cbc.ca/news/viewpoint/vp_mallick/20080225.html

"After all, what problems has intellectualism ever solved?"

Ummm.... obviously not YOUR problem!!

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that's a related issue all right.

[avon-deer.livejournal.com]

A store called Evil Empire? :D

[schnee.livejournal.com]

Mall-Wart, probably. :)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

A nickname for WalMart because of their "Darth Vader" mentality with respect to both control and repression of employees and forcing locally-owned businesses to close by dishonest and unfair competitive practices.

[avon-deer.livejournal.com]

Wow..the death grip as well? Harsh. :D

I think Walmart own ASDA here.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yup. The death grip is a standard WalMart business practice, applied at the least hint of union organizing on the part of employees and without any compunction to business rivals of all sorts.

WalMart is now noted for the effect they tend to have on small businesses in any town they invade. They cut prices until all the storefronts in town are vacant, run out of business by the competition. Then when there is no competition left, they have free rein to do whatever they choose and people have no choices left in terms of where to buy the things they need. In the central and southern states, this has become notoriously obvious: central business districts that look like ghost towns, with boarded up windows and second hand clothing and junk stores being all there is left. In many places, even gasoline can only be purchased from the local WalMart because they forced the filling station only businesses to close through price manipulation.

In the rapidly tightening economy here, WalMart stands to gain (and their profit figures for the last two quarters show it.) They are huge. They can afford to take a loss now and then in order to make a long term gain, and they are willing to do it. They also bring in as much stuff as possible from China (in spite of advertising their commitment to "buy American goods") so that even canned fruits and vegetables often originate in Asia rather than in the Americas. It has become a feedback loop that is growing less and less likely to be broken until it strangles itself and many others with it.

Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

You know, it only takes one bad product from China through "Evil Inc." to make a few hundred sick and die to turn the tables on Wally World- the balance of power has that uncertainty about it. Speaking of death, I heard the family of that temp worker who was stampeded to death on Black Friday last year got a settlement from Evil Inc.

Also, I thought you grew your own veggies... is this not true?

Re: Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves

[altivo.livejournal.com]

We do grow what we can. But when you live this far north, that's only about a third of the year. While in theory I'd love to grow a huge garden and can and freeze things, I simply don't have the time what with working a full time job as well. Back in the day when only men worked and women stayed home to cook and care for children, many of them could and did grow huge gardens and can or freeze the results. It can be done. But modern lifestyles and economics are not the same as they were in the 1930s.

Re: Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

Understandable (I'm impressed you managed to find the time at all)- do you see yourself adopting such a practice if either you or your signifigant other leave/quit your professions?

Re: Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves

[altivo.livejournal.com]

At the moment, if either of us suddenly was without work and had no prospect of getting any, then we'd have to do the gardening and preserving thing in order to avoid starvation. My retirement money is not accessible for a few years yet (seven or eight at least) and though he's drawing from his retirement savings now, that's not enough to let him avoid working at his music in order to gain more income from it.

I do know how to can and freeze food safely so that it still is edible and tasty. We've done small batches in the past. Drying is also an option that works well for some things, like tomatoes or strawberries. I enjoy it as an occasional hobby, but I suspect it would be drudgery to do it on a big scale. I can well remember my mother and grandmother putting up bushels of tomatoes or peaches at once and that's hard work. (In fact, I've written about it in a couple of stories years ago.)

Re: Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

Interesting... How long does the food you've frozen tend to keep, anyhow?

Also, does the prospect of being without work frighten you- or is it merely a financial bother?

Re: Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I've survived longish periods of unemployment, up to 19 or 20 months, before. It doesn't frighten me, but it doesn't please me either. Having no medical insurance at all is the frightening part in this country. We'd manage on food, clothing and shelter for quite a while.

I'd worry about my animals, who need feed and occasional vet and farrier visits, though. And paying our real estate taxes, which don't go away just because we're unemployed. Fortunately, we have no mortgage. The house and land were all paid for ten years ago. But we have to pay the electric bill, and probably the phone.

Re: Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves willing to work without coverage :)

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

I've no medical insurance either (big surprise, right?), but I make a point not to do things that could cause me to lose a hand or a foot or anything like that... I would think given your line of work, you probably don't have nearly as much risk at your jobsite :P (I suppose one of your horses could hypothetically kick you or something, but still your margin for risk seems a lot slimmer than many I know.)

So, overall, your animals are the real cause for concern then- I just wanted it straight from the horse's mouth, that's all.

Re: Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves willing to work without coverage :)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

There's a fair amount of medical risk. For one thing, we're about twice your age. Gary kept bees for several years and then suddenly became sensitive to stings. One sting put him in the hospital overnight at a cost of several thousand dollars, for example, and he really has no insurance. I have some insurance through work but I can't put him on it unless Illinois passes a gay marriage bill.

Yes, the animals are a primary concern, though. After all, it's not their fault, and I'm responsible for them.

Re: Evil Inc. is looking for a few good slaves willing to work without coverage :)

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

Gary kept bees? Cool. I always liked them. Yeah, I suppose getting regular to intermittant does of bee venom would eventually make the body "allergic" after a time...

[schnee.livejournal.com]

I'd say this is incredible, except it's becoming commonplace.

Mmm, I think one doesn't preclude the other, actually.

Ewww, though - that asparagus sounds seriously disgusting. Not that I know that much about what vegetables are supposed to look like, generally speaking, but I'm pretty sure I'd notice if it grew mouldy, at least.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Produce at WalMart stores, at least in this area, is always on the disgusting side. It's obvious that they just don't care enough to hire produce staff who know the business. It's easier and cheaper to hire the same low quality, undereducated, undermotivated, and of course underpaid employees for every department and swap them around like interchangeable cogs. Produce management requires special skills and training. You can't put it out like canned goods and leave it there until it sells, but that's what they seem to do.

The same is true for baked goods. The quality of their breads is decent if not the best, but they don't rotate stock properly. You have to pay attention or you'll get moldy rolls and bread like styrofoam.

[schnee.livejournal.com]

Ewww. x.x

I know what you mean, though - there's (some) stores here as well where I wouldn't buy produce, usually. Aldi's pretty bad in that regard, for example, although with them, I guess it's to be expected - you get what you pay for.

Bread seems less of a problem at least, generally speaking, but then, I always just bake my own nowadays. Just to be sure, though, do you mean fresh-baked bread that's made at the store itself or pre-packaged stuff?

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I never buy pre-packaged bread any more. I was referring to the stuff that is at least supposedly baked in the store.

Oddly enough, the produce at the Aldi in Woodstock is pretty high quality, though the selection is very mundane and limited. No asparagus there ever. They usually have carrots, tomatoes, potatoes, peppers, bananas and apples and that's about it. The apples will be "Red Delicious" and/or "Yellow Delicious" neither of which is worth biting into. The rest of the stuff is fresh and clean, or has been whenever I've been in the store. I don't go there often because the selection is so extremely limited on nearly everything.

[schnee.livejournal.com]

Yeah - I don't know how Aldi over there compares to ours, but that seems to be their business model, generally speaking; offering a very limited selection and competing on price there. (I actually remember going there with a shopping list of some 6 to 12 items I needed for baking, from yeast to syrup to higher-type flour (550, IIRC), and they had literally NOTHING - not a single item.)

Fruits and vegetables are always a hit and miss there, too. Fortunately, the nearest Aldi market for me is sharing a location with a regular, higher-quality supermarket, so I can easily get everything I can't / don't get at Aldi there instead (or just go there right away, since they do have cheap house brands to price-match Aldi's brands for at least some products, too).

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I've had doco recommend Aldi to me a couple of times, so I assumed they were rather different over there than they are here. Your description, though, does make them sound like just what we have here. One kind of flour, one kind of sugar, usually just one of each thing they carry and many things I use regularly they just don't have at all. We do find the unknown brands that Aldi stocks to be of acceptable quality in many cases, but the holes in their coverage (like your mention of no yeast or syrup) make them unusable as a regular supplier. WalMart does rather better in that respect once you learn to locate the items in their huge stock display floor. (Employees are often no help because they don't know what "yeast" or "straw mushrooms" are to begin with, though they all know where the Coca Cola and frozen pizzas are of course.) The big issue with WalMart (other than their abusive treatment of employees) is the produce department. I absolutely require fruits and vegetables in my diet (unlike most Americans, I guess.) WalMart does not come anywhere near meeting my cleanliness, quality, or price requirements, though most of the other large chains here do so to at least some degree. Unfortunately, the really good alternatives such as Meijer are just too far away to get to on a regular basis.

[schnee.livejournal.com]

One kind of flour, one kind of sugar, usually just one of each thing they carry and many things I use regularly they just don't have at all.

That's precisely what Aldi's like here, too. :)

Wal-Mart I've never been to, though. They tried to establish a presence here, but ultimately failed, and they never had any stores near where I live, anyway (if they had, chances are I would've checked them out, but I can't say whether I would've shopped there regularly, naturally; however, incidents like their attempts to regulate private relationships etc. between employees, and their subsequent getting slapped down in court for that, didn't exactly put them in a favourable light as far as I'm concerned).

Curiously enough, I've never been to a Wal-Mart when I visited the USA, either, just Target and a regional chain (Ukrop's).

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Target is rather a different thing. They were around as a cheap to midrange department store (clothing, household items, cheap furniture, automotive supplies) for a long time before they started having grocery items and many of their stores still don't have the grocery division in them. I don't expect much from them and really haven't checked into their grocery coverage at all. K-Mart also tends to have some food items (mostly junk snacks and frozen pizza type things) but doesn't qualify as a full service grocer in my opinion.

We did have two fairly reliable full service grocery chains in the Chicago area up until about 2000 or so: Jewel and Dominick. Both were owned here and were regional chains. Both were sold out to national grocery chains, and though they retained their branding and names, the quality of their management has declined while their prices have gone through the stratosphere. Jewel is in Woodstock, about nine miles from home, but I almost never go there. It's a large store, well-maintained and well stocked with everything I use... at about twice the price I pay even at the local Certified grocer. The produce is good but way overpriced, and the focus of the store seems to be on ready to eat delicatessen items. They even have a coffee shop and little tables right in the store, like a sort of sidewalk cafe. The Dominick's in Chicago where Gary's mom lives is like that too, equally overpriced and with stock distributed in an incomprehensible jumble throughout the store.

[schnee.livejournal.com]

Twice the price? o.o Wow - that's quite a difference, certainly much more than I've ever seen here.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

They play a game with prices. If you "join" as a "preferred customer" and carry an ID card, then you get a "special" price that is more like the regular market price for the item. Without the card, the price is artificially high to encourage you to sign up for the card.

The card has a barcode that is scanned at the register and they track everything you buy. Then they use this information any way they choose, including selling it to marketers, or anyone else who will pay. It generates sales calls on the phone, junk e-mail, junk paper mail, and a lot of privacy invasion in my opinion. So I refuse to sign up for the card and therefore am not eligible for the real price.

Food Chemist @ work

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

My relatives love taking me to a grocery store because I know where pretty much everything is... saving them such pointless exercises as "where are the vidalia onions?" and about how much it costs. I shocked my grandma recently by guessing the price of a microwave pizza within 5 cents of the amount- now she thinks I'm frugal :P

For most Americans, Alt, fruit is either Grape Soda or Strawberry Qwik- I eat the occasional canned pineapple & (gasp) banana or green vegetable. Just last week I had a green pepper and half a lemon. My neighbors have a lemon tree which produces some intensely strong fruit- it's like a tonic to take a bite of that stuff; you can literally feel it burn off impurities in the body.

That said, I guess I'm not the "average American" either :P (but on the plus side, I'm not grotesquely obese, wheezing and coughing with every step or in need of assistance to carry my purchases out to the parking lot... Car? What would I need a car for? Home's only a 30 minute walk from here.)

Speaking of which...

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

...I just found out an Aldi is being erected nearby where I live- tell me, what things have you noticed that they carry I should keep an eye out for (just go with things you look for& have found there, as you have a pretty heathy pallet).

Re: Speaking of which...

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Well, I've only visited the local Aldi three times. The fresh vegetables they have are very limited but the quality was good (whereas Walmart has a great variety but they are all wilted and deteriorating.) The price of what they have at Aldi is almost always lower than anywhere else. Their house brand canned goods, like soups or tomato products, are very cheap in price but about as good as anywhere else. Their evaporated milk (which I use in baking and in coffee) is half the price of anyone else, though probably also a bit lower in fat content.

Their dairy products are as good as anyone's but cheaper. The meats and fish I haven't really tried but they look good enough and have a good price. We've gone there mostly to buy canned goods. Oh, and bring your own carrying containers, they don't provide any. ;p

The rolling carts, BTW, require a 25 cent deposit, which you get back when you return them to their storage rack. This saves them the trouble of going out to fetch the carts from the parking lot. Even if people abandon their 25 cents, and I'm sure some do, the neighborhood kids will quickly bring the carts back to the entrance in order to get the money. Given that those carts can cost upward of $250 apiece now, this is probably a reasonable solution.

Re: Speaking of which...

[gabrielhorse.livejournal.com]

It all sounds good. I'll certainly be keeping an eye out for their loose carts :P Thanks, Alt- very good info, indeed.

[goldenstallion.livejournal.com]

Whinnyhi, Rider.

Well gee I figured you would have figured this out by now. BTW a local farmer grows apparagus delicious and fresh and in a brown paper bag huge for a couple bucks. Of course it makes your pee smell weird immediately and DO NOT leave the steamer pot for more than one day or the whole house stinks.

Great with butter or what my Doctor Tanna Shanti (old Indian woman probably seventy considered the best there is by her associates about five feet tall) requires me to eat, Smart Balance or Olivio. Tastes good but is hard as a rock impossible to spread even at room temperature.

I am glad you eat lots of veggies since fatty meat is worse than smoking for bad health. Heh, it has been eight months since. The world is a very stinky place. Trust me my poor feet need to be chopped off to save my sense of smell.

I enjoy cashiers here. There is a middle age biker chick bitch type at Meijers I always look for who wears her leathers and her tattoos and is very smart and very cool and fun to visit and a very good cashier who has it down pat. Just relax and find out. Life is good.

Impers being an imp of course.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Yes, I do have it figured out. But I have no choice. We really can't afford the local grocer any more. The difference in cost for the same list of items can be as high as 25 or 30%

I find that Aldi has better quality produce than WalMart and for a much lower price. Unfortunately, they have very little variety there, but for basic tomatoes, potatoes, and peppers they are a good source. No chance of getting ginger root or asparagus from them, though. WalMart has those, but usually overpriced and half rotten so I'm not getting them there either. The farmer's markets and stands will help once local produce is available, but it's too early yet. The WalMart problem, as I've said before, is that they don't sell enough variety produce to feel they have to do a good job at it. The core of their grocery business is obviously frozen convenience foods and junk snacks, in spite of the fact that they have double the floor space devoted to groceries when compared to the local Certified grocer who has been in business selling only grocery items for about 70 years.

[hellmutt.livejournal.com]

"didn't know lettuce from cabbage, had no idea what broccoli was, and couldn't figure out how to ring up the sweet corn since it goes not by weight but by number of ears purchased"

D:
D:
D:

Aldi over here is pushing low-priced fruit and veg. We went to one the other day; it didn't seem bad at all, but didn't have as wide a selection of it as other empires have. (Of course, that's leaving aside the issue of what's been flown in from where...)

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Aldi is hardly an empire here, just scattered stores though I gather they are planning a big expansion in the US to take advantage of the downed economy.

The produce in the nearest Aldi is of decent quality but, as you say, the selection is very limited. This time of year, much of it is probably flown in from Mexico. I want a good green grocer. We had them in Chicago, but they don't exist out here. In summer the farm markets and stands help, but in winter it's desolate.

[hellmutt.livejournal.com]

Yep; I don't think Aldi is very big here, either. There's one in the centre of Manchester and another in a retail park closer to home that I only noticed when we went there over the weekend.

Also over the weekend, I saw little baby blueberry plants on sale in Homebase and thought of you. Sadly, we've nowhere to plant them; our garden is all wood chipped over with a stream and rockery and such. Nice in its way, but no good for dogs or berries. *finds no photos of it on Flickr account; should take some*

[altivo.livejournal.com]

Blueberries are finicky. We have tried more than once to get some additional plants established and with no success, even though they are placed within a couple of yards of the one clump we have that continues to yield nicely every year. In general, they are supposed to like acid soil where ours tends to be alkaline because of all the limestone in the bedrock and gravel. Peat would probably be ideal rather than the clay that we have. And lots of sun, which we do have, though not quite so much where those berry bushes are except in June and July when the sun is high. At other times, the shade from our tall oak woods tends to keep the sun off.

A rock garden such as you describe is often an excellent place for strawberries, though. You can get quite a lot of them from a small space and make tea from the leaves as well. ;D

[hellmutt.livejournal.com]

Ah, we kept strawberries when I was a pup! The blackbirds had 'em all with ingenious regularity; we had more luck from going to "pick-your-own" places. I recall blackberries, too, on brambles growing wild along my grandmother's road.

I think I was fortunate to grow up with at least that nod to home-grown fruit and veg. Kind of like I'm grateful to have camped, even if I now avoid camping holidays as an adult. I'm no allotment gardener, but I'm no Wal-Mart "whut's dis green fluffy stuff? Izzit meant to be dat shape?" till-monkey either. ;D

[cabcat.livejournal.com]

People don't stay long enough in sales for technical experience I guess. Since the sales force always has the highest turn over what with management tossing them each time profit drops or because it's so unpleasant dealing with the genral public that they burn out or leave for better jobs.

[altivo.livejournal.com]

I think that depends on the employer. Wal*Mart is not very nice to work for. They use people as if they were inanimate objects, and throw them away at will.